Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

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Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
I dropped off this Winter issue with the printer early last Tuesday, January 2nd.

I know they started on it right away, so you should all be receiving it soon, possibly within a week, though I don't like pestering them for exact dates of completion.

Please start sending me any material you have for the 2018 Spring edition. Don't delay sending me your rally programmes too, once you've decided them at the area planning meetings.


Lough Erne Rally, Northern Ireland, first two weeks in July, 2018
 The information in DC236 is tentative, as you will see, but all can now be confirmed definitely – I have bought my ferry ticket! (40% off with STENA, on New Year's Eve!)

Tom Bailey of LE Yacht Club affirmed my dates just prior to going racing in a J24 event on New Year's Day, and enthusing about the winter wildlife on the lough. 'The DCA is always welcome!'

There has been some really encouraging enthusuastic interest shown in this year's rally already – read the two reports in DC236 and my full paragraph in the rallies section for 2018, for more information. Email me if there are any further questions. More online discussion will be encouraged closer to the event.

Keith
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Andy Biggs 3272
The Journal arrived over the weekend. Many thanks for the hard work putting it together.

Looks excellent- once again!
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
Thank you Andy.

It's a bit shorter than the more usual 80 pages (these days), but to my mind the wide differences in the subjects of the articles and reports make it feel almost as big. They went into the post last Friday after I had dropped them off very early in the morning. Miles Dent told me today that his copy had arrived in France this morning, and most UK deliveries would have been yesterday morning, with one or two possibly on Saturday, like yours. Not bad going, really! They were over a week late, though, due to a simple machine breakdown at the printers that needed spare parts to be posted.

Hope to see you on Feb 3rd.

Keith



-----Original Message-----
From: Andy Biggs 3272 [via DCA Forum] <[hidden email]>
To: Keith Muscott 1516 <[hidden email]>
Sent: Mon, 22 Jan 2018 18:13
Subject: Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

The Journal arrived over the weekend. Many thanks for the hard work putting it together.

Looks excellent- once again!


If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Chris Davidson
Keith,

I enjoyed reading this winter's journal and the drawings of the Montrose coble reminded me of the visits in the late 1960s from my prep school near the fishing village of Johnshaven, to see the salmon nets at the mouth  of the river North Esk. At low tide we saw big salmon in the nets and I remember the cobles coming close in.

I am a bit confused by the description of the coble drawing at the top of p8, which is described firstly as a "Montrose Coble with oar" but in the text is described a "River Tweed Coble". Whichever, they are lovely traditional boats and I have strong memories of the tough lives of the fisherman on the north sea coast.

I found this clip showing the construction of a wooden salmon coble at Joseph Johnston & Son of Montrose:

http://movingimage.nls.uk/film/8723&rating=4

Incidentally, my great grandfather and great great great grandfathers were sea captains from Aberdeen and I am collating information about their seafaring careers.

Best wishes,
Chris
Chris Davidson
GP14 (built 1961) and 16' open clinker dinghy under construction
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
Chris

Well spotted.

If you want accuracy, as you do, go to page 39 in DC236 and write above the drawing of the oars: 'River Tweed Up-river Coble with Oar, Net Pallet and Building Tongs', and cross out the sentence containing 'Montrose Coble ... page 8' underneath the drawing of the boat. And then add: 'This 14ft Coble was the smallest of three sizes built for commercial salmon fishing in the Tweed at Spittal. Possibly built by the Lee family of Berwick, or the Berwick Salmon Fisheries Company'.

Then go to page 9 and cross out the first sentence under 'Scottish Cobles' after the word (Above) and leave the rest of the text beginning 'The thole pins ...' The title 'Montrose Coble with Oar' is correct.

I no longer believe they are the same boat, and I was thrown by the identical sizes of the hulls, about 14ft, which were suitable for river work. Montrose boats were bigger, and the Tweed boats always smaller than them, it has been claimed, but these two drawings show cobles of near-identical length. Also misled by concentrating on the oars, but the thole pins are different on close inspection, and finally, by being knackered at the time of processing those images!

I'll publish your letter in DC2237, with corrections underneath.

Many thanks for the link to Joeseph Johnston's. Most interesting. And don't forget to keep us informed about your sea captain ancestors.

All the best,
Keith




Keith,

I enjoyed reading this winter's journal and the drawings of the Montrose coble reminded me of the visits in the late 1960s from my prep school near the fishing village of Johnshaven, to see the salmon nets at the mouth  of the river North Esk. At low tide we saw big salmon in the nets and I remember the cobles coming close in.

I am a bit confused by the description of the coble drawing at the top of p8, which is described firstly as a "Montrose Coble with oar" but in the text is described a "River Tweed Coble". Whichever, they are lovely traditional boats and I have strong memories of the tough lives of the fisherman on the north sea coast.

I found this clip showing the construction of a wooden salmon coble at Joseph Johnston & Son of Montrose:

http://movingimage.nls.uk/film/8723&rating=4

Incidentally, my great grandfather and great great great grandfathers were sea captains from Aberdeen and I am collating information about their seafaring careers.

Best wishes,
Chris
Chris Davidson
GP14 (built 1961) and 16' open clinker dinghy under construction


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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
Chris

David Chatterley has just sent me an email about the flat-bottomed wide-beamed Scottish cobles after reading DC236, as he has seen them on the West Coast of Scotland – they obviously got about!

He has attached four photographs, and the two that excite me most are of a little blue wooden coble he saw near Croig on Mull in 1989, which I would say is identical to the Tweed upriver salmon boat, upswept bow and all. To be included in the Spring issue.

Your letter and David's will be in the Correspondence section of the same journal, together with my corrections.

Keith
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

John Perry 710

Hi Keith

I think you may have sent this message to the wrong person

Best wishes

John


On 24/01/2018 10:23, Keith Muscott 1516 [via DCA Forum] wrote:
Chris

David Chatterley has just sent me an email about the flat-bottomed wide-beamed Scottish cobles after reading DC236, as he has seen them on the West Coast of Scotland – they obviously got about!

He has attached four photographs, and the two that excite me most are of a little blue wooden coble he saw near Croig on Mull in 1989, which I would say is identical to the Tweed upriver salmon boat, upswept bow and all. To be included in the Spring issue.

Your letter and David's will be in the Correspondence section of the same journal, together with my corrections.

Keith


If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
http://forum.dinghycruising.org.uk/Dinghy-Cruising-236-Winter-Journal-2017-2018-and-Lough-Erne-Rally-tp1136p1146.html
To start a new topic under Flotsam & Jetsam: Everything else dinghy cruising, email [hidden email]
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NAML

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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
No John, I think you are geared up to take breaking emails from the DCA Forum!
As was the case the last time you sent me a similar email. If you don't want to see new forum emails as they are posted you should visit the forum and change the preferences in your account.

My email to Chris was sent in reply to one of his – he had chosen to engage me via the Forum, so my reply was obviously posted there when I sent it.

Nice to hear from you anyway!

Keith



-----Original Message-----
From: John Perry 710 [via DCA Forum] <[hidden email]>
To: Keith Muscott 1516 <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wed, 24 Jan 2018 10:44
Subject: Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Hi Keith
I think you may have sent this message to the wrong person
Best wishes
John

On 24/01/2018 10:23, Keith Muscott 1516 [via DCA Forum] wrote:
Chris

David Chatterley has just sent me an email about the flat-bottomed wide-beamed Scottish cobles after reading DC236, as he has seen them on the West Coast of Scotland – they obviously got about!

He has attached four photographs, and the two that excite me most are of a little blue wooden coble he saw near Croig on Mull in 1989, which I would say is identical to the Tweed upriver salmon boat, upswept bow and all. To be included in the Spring issue.

Your letter and David's will be in the Correspondence section of the same journal, together with my corrections.

Keith


If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
http://forum.dinghycruising.org.uk/Dinghy-Cruising-236-Winter-Journal-2017-2018-and-Lough-Erne-Rally-tp1136p1146.html
To start a new topic under Flotsam & Jetsam: Everything else dinghy cruising, email <a target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="about:blank">[hidden email]
To unsubscribe from DCA Forum, <a target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="about:blank">click here.
NAML




If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Chris Davidson
Keith,

Thanks for your email about more Scottish cobles. Whilst I know little about them, they are both beautiful and purposeful.
Here is an interesting article:

https://www.pressreader.com/uk/the-courier-advertiser-perth-and-perthshire-edition/20170513/283326112274939

A visit to  the Anstruther museum in Fife would be fun.

Regards,
Chris

Chris Davidson
GP14 (built 1961) and 16' open clinker dinghy under construction
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
Chris

Now here's a case in point: that model of a Scots salmon coble he's holding has a definite River Tweed upswept bow section, very reminiscent of a Viking boat, while the sternsheets are planked over for about 18 inches running forard like the Montrose boats! What's a poor editor to do?

Couple of things: if you like Kathleen Jamie's work as much as I do, you'll know that in one of her books she describes these small salmon cobles working an estuary on the East Coast, where she lives overlooking the river.

Another point: yes, Anstruther is marvellous, but the East Coast is in love with the big Scots trawlers, sail and motor. Lodestar Books keeps on bringing out books on the big trawlers; Scots authors never tire of writing about the same boats over and over. Meanwhile, they are all forgetting about the greater number of highly individual little sail and oar coastal fishing boats that are disappearing from up there, which used to keep a man and his sons busy and the family fed, rather than making profits for big syndicates. They will be forgotten soon if we're not careful.

Thanks for pointing me towards the article; it is excellent. I'll alert Alan Smith to it (one of the whammel-fishing Smith brothers of Sunderland Point, Lune Estuary).

Keith




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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Paul Holdsworth 3279
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Keith Muscott 1516
Superb journal once again, Keith. I particularly enjoyed David Hall's article about his conversion to junk rig - it's always especially interesting to read about home waters.
David wrote:
"While sailing back into Bowness Bay we were overtaken by one of the cruise boats. The Captain commented, through the amplifier to the mostly Chinese tourists on board, on my unusual junk rig as he went past and afterwards I wondered if it was Paul?"
It was indeed me. While my colleagues are expert at handling powered passenger vessels, only a couple of us are 'proper' sailors too - most wouldn't know the difference between a junk rig and a roller blind, I'm afraid.
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Re: Dinghy Cruising 236, Winter Journal 2017/2018, and Lough Erne Rally

Keith Muscott 1516
Administrator
Very good! He'll be pleased about that. And I'm glad that you enjoyed the current issue.

Keith